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- Why is the Fire Emblem fanbase so elitist?
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All I'm hearing about the newer games is complaints. "Awakening sucked! Fates is a waifu simulator! Wahh!"
I always see how so and so should be in the new Warriors game and such but why? Awakening saved the entire series and Fates was not half as bad as people said it was. I just wish we could all stop being such douchebags is all. I'm hyped for the new Warriors game even if it is all just Awakening/Fates characters. Anyone else?
Come at me!
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I'll take the bait because I was passing by.
1. More people buying Awakening doesn't instantly make it a great game 2. Fates' story and settings are... pretty bad. Putting aside the sexual harassment (which clearly was bad enough they had to censor it) aside, you would have a hard time defending the story 3. I'll buy Fire Emblem Warriors when it comes out. But I'm not buying Kozaki Warriors. In other words, lol, it won't sell well and just deserts so.
Blog... --> http://tdnshumi.blogspot.com/
Currently: Monster Hunter XX (3DS), The Alliance Alive (3DS), Radiant Historia (3DS)
(edited 2 days ago)quote
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The complaints generally boils down to people liking FE before Nintendo started dumbing it down for Americans.
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I don't know, Fire emblem was literally going to cancelled if the sales didn't improve, Nintendo gave them one last shot, and then they made Awakening which the developers through was possibility to be the last Fire Emblem, but awakening sold like crazy which did indeed "save the series". I honestly don't know how certain people can claim awakening didn't save the series when it's back-up by facts from the developers themselves.
Anyway, after awakening + fates people started b****ing about a lot of stuff. I think it's best to ignore the stupid fans, Fire emblem has improved a ton over the years, I think personally Fates went a step-backwards with the bad storyline / too much waifu elements etc but overall both games were still pretty solid, I think they'll hopefully learn from what didn't work so well and they'll make another great fire emblem game, in which a few stupid people will continue to b**** about everything regardless, best to ignore them and save yourself the headache.
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All FE have good and bad aspects, but Awakening was just all around disturbingly mediocre in its dialogue, setting, plot and gameplay.
Battle animation and music were for the most part awesome, so I did get some sort of compensation.
And the Lord [...] drive out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron.
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Awakening was my first Fire Emblem and since then I was hooked.
I tried to go back and play Shadow Dragon and had to stop halfway because it was so damn generic.
Come at me!
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This isn't something new pretty much every entry since Sacred Stones has had players claiming that Intelligent Systems had ruined Fire Emblem and the fanbase has always been fighting over what entries are good and bad in Fire Emblem.
The only difference is that Awakening and Fates sold so much that they feel threatened by the new direction and the success that they basically lash out against them more. Since their existence and repeated success only proves elitists have absolutely no clue about what makes Fire Emblem appealing and are out of touch with what the fanbase actually likes, the Fire Emblem Heroes pre-release character poll results are a good showcase of it.
'The fact of the matter is that we've been here constantly. We've been betraying peoples expectations, in a good way, for a long time.'
3DS: 2449-4649-4995
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Falchion92 posted...
I tried to go back and play Shadow Dragon and had to stop halfway because it was so damn generic. Shadow Dragon on the DS is easily one of the worst Fire Emblem in the franchise, alongside the original Gaiden. Try 3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10 for more substantial enjoyment. FE5 is stupidly tedious tho, but the art assets mate... They're so tight!
And the Lord [...] drive out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron.
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Salocool posted...
All FE have good and bad aspects, but Awakening was just all around disturbingly mediocre in its dialogue, setting, plot and gameplay. First of all, sorry do detour a little... So FE: Awakening is sort of like Metroid: Other M? Will Metroid: Samus Returns be the FE: Awakening of Metroid? Sakamoto only got one shot from Nintendo, I think. I still prefer the older FE titles, the gruesome thing of absolute dead in the game was terrifying. I needed to do a quest over and over again to keep all my characters alive. The casual play for FE was the point I left the franchise, I wanted to use the casual route, but my heart said gruesome for it being gruesome before.
I am the first one who claims that the next 2D Metroid game will be "Metroid Dread".
Signed on 24th of August, 2017 |
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DASHWOOD posted...
I still prefer the older FE titles, the gruesome thing of absolute dead in the game was terrifying. I needed to do a quest over and over again to keep all my characters alive. The casual play for FE was the point I left the franchise, I wanted to use the casual route, but my heart said gruesome for it being gruesome before. I don't mind Casual options, all I require for my enjoyment is a decent plot, fantastic map design, and if possibly some more than average BGM/art assets. The "defeat them all" tediousness of Awakening, mixed to the inability of the designers to organize the enemies and their equipment in a mean to stimulate strategy rather than brute force, made for an extremely dull experience. Conquest!Hard/Lunatic was the best gameplay experience of the franchise if you ask me. Only time I had as much fun was Hector Hard Mode with minimal Marcus abuse.
And the Lord [...] drive out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron.
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arvilino posted...
This isn't something new pretty much every entry since Sacred Stones has had players claiming that Intelligent Systems had ruined Fire Emblem and the fanbase has always been fighting over what entries are good and bad in Fire Emblem. Pretty much this. I mean, it's not like the older titles disappeared. If you hate the newer game sso much just go play the old ones you do like. And it's not like they dumbed it down. The old perma death route is still there. People just choose to ignore it because they think older games somehow are better because they lack a casual option.
Come at me!
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Falchion92 posted...
Pretty much this. I mean, it's not like the older titles disappeared. If you hate the newer game sso much just go play the old ones you do like. And it's not like they dumbed it down. You're both completely missing the point of why Awakening is so despised by folks who played games that were actually designed with proper challenge in mind, and a storyline not overly shaped by a shonen mentality.
And the Lord [...] drive out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron.
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Salocool posted...
Falchion92 posted...Pretty much this. I mean, it's not like the older titles disappeared. If you hate the newer game sso much just go play the old ones you do like. And it's not like they dumbed it down. Bye bye, old-school Metroid then...
I am the first one who claims that the next 2D Metroid game will be "Metroid Dread".
Signed on 24th of August, 2017
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DASHWOOD posted...
Salocool posted...Falchion92 posted...Pretty much this. I mean, it's not like the older titles disappeared. If you hate the newer game sso much just go play the old ones you do like. And it's not like they dumbed it down. Salocool posted... Falchion92 posted...Pretty much this. I mean, it's not like the older titles disappeared. If you hate the newer game sso much just go play the old ones you do like. And it's not like they dumbed it down. Challenge is subjective. Your definition is not my definition. Those 'folks' can go and stay in the past while the rest of us move forwards.
Come at me!
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Falchion92 posted...
Those 'folks' can go and stay in the past while the rest of us move forwards. You can grind as you want. The enemies are randomly placed on the maps. You find that proper, sellable design? That's "forward-thinking"? It's like playing a f***in' Pollock painting.
And the Lord [...] drive out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron.
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Gee, you call the Fire Emblem fanbase elitist, but I'd say you're acting like an elitist yourself TC.
"Cower before the might of the magic Imhullu: once forbidden, now unleashed!"
-Gharnef (Fire Emblem Shadow Dragon) |
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Salocool posted...
Falchion92 posted...Pretty much this. I mean, it's not like the older titles disappeared. If you hate the newer game sso much just go play the old ones you do like. And it's not like they dumbed it down. Sorry I don't believe you. As some one who's followed the series for like 13 years, proper challenges like Shadow Dragon's H5, Conquest's Lunatic and New Mystery's Lunatic modes are frequently brushed off as fake difficulty. Whereas you'll see people push an incredibly easy game like Path of Radiance as "proper challenge" or a game and its story even though its a by the books a shonen young boy's rise to power story. It just feels like a bunch of people pretending to care about the gameplay in order to make it look like their complaint is more than just about the waifus or whatever.
'The fact of the matter is that we've been here constantly. We've been betraying peoples expectations, in a good way, for a long time.'
3DS: 2449-4649-4995
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themegaman7 posted...
Gee, you call the Fire Emblem fanbase elitist, but I'd say you're acting like an elitist yourself TC. |
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arvilino posted...
proper challenges like Shadow Dragon's H5, Conquest's Lunatic and New Mystery's Lunatic modes are frequently brushed off as fake difficulty. Because the only difficulty such modes have is to throw stat-overinflated enemies at you that are still dumb as bricks. |
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Maetch posted...
arvilino posted...proper challenges like Shadow Dragon's H5, Conquest's Lunatic and New Mystery's Lunatic modes are frequently brushed off as fake difficulty. Until very recently where the enemies started taking each other into account(Fates) the "smarter" enemies in the series were actually alot easier as they'd prioritise healing or retreating at low HP over killing you. The enemies didn't need to be smart as long as they charged you and were placed on the map in a way that would effectively place pressure on the player since even if the enemies are dumb if they can kill you in 1, 2 or 3 hits and the developer puts them in a good spot on the map they're going to challenge you. Those difficulty modes mades the enemies strong enough that their formations really mean something and become like a puzzle to overcome rather than well a bunch of cannon fodder with bad stats killing themselves on your units.
'The fact of the matter is that we've been here constantly. We've been betraying peoples expectations, in a good way, for a long time.'
3DS: 2449-4649-4995
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they also spit on people who played Sacred Stones or anything that's not Shadow Dragon or Geneology/Theracia776
3DS Friend Code: 0387-9017-6003 DC:5400-2358-7574 NID:TheChoujinVirus
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8mQScjlXbBE #torentialdownpour in a nutshell |
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I don't quite understand, if you enjoy the games/series, what does it matter what other people think or say?
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themegaman7 posted...
Gee, you call the Fire Emblem fanbase elitist, but I'd say you're acting like an elitist yourself TC. This in response to the TC response to me. I am moving forward, but I just like the old school games more, more like the origin and originality of it. Look at "Warrior" games (LoZ, FE, One Piece,...) You call that innovation? For me it's a huge backdrop because it's just milking. I don't say the games aren't good, but lately all games run/look/feel/... the same and originality is gone and it's all about the money now for businesses. Edit: Blue Bomber 99 posted... I don't quite understand, if you enjoy the games/series, what does it matter what other people think or say? Also this. It doesn't matter what anybody thinks about you, series, games,... what/who/where you play. We all are just giving our opinions and discuss things and if people take this to serious or get mad it's their own fault for accusing people. This is what the boards are made for. If you ask a question you need to go to the "answer" subject, that's what that is made for. Unlike the TC who can't take something.
I am the first one who claims that the next 2D Metroid game will be "Metroid Dread".
Signed on 24th of August, 2017
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arvilino posted...
Maetch posted...arvilino posted...proper challenges like Shadow Dragon's H5, Conquest's Lunatic and New Mystery's Lunatic modes are frequently brushed off as fake difficulty. I'm talking about things like New Mystery Reverse Lunatic, where if you don't make Kris perfect, you will NEVER beat the prologue because nobody else can kill anything. Awakening Lunatic+ is similar in that you're pretty much hiding behind Frederick until you clear Chapter 6 and can start grinding on the map or with DLC. That's not challenge. That's throwing brick walls at you out of sadism. |
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I swear, sometimes, it's as childish as the Sonic fanbase, only with less OCs.
Uh... A-Are you sure to interact with others?
-Mario, Ganondorf, Sonic, Bowser Jr. / Wendy, Duck Hunt, Marth, Mewtwo Mainer. |
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Maetch posted...
I'm talking about things like New Mystery Reverse Lunatic, where if you don't make Kris perfect, you will NEVER beat the prologue because nobody else can kill anything. Awakening Lunatic+ is similar in that you're pretty much hiding behind Frederick until you clear Chapter 6 and can start grinding on the map or with DLC. That's not challenge. That's throwing brick walls at you out of sadism. I've beaten New Mystery Reverse Lunatic without a perfect Kris. In some situations Lunatic Reverse isn't actually that much harder than Lunatic because the enemies attack power means at times on Lunatic mode you're not going to attack during the player phase if the enemy will counter you and you end up being able to beat certain chapters with a similar stategy. (though you rely on more ranged attacks in Lunatic Reverse)
'The fact of the matter is that we've been here constantly. We've been betraying peoples expectations, in a good way, for a long time.'
3DS: 2449-4649-4995
(edited 2 days ago)quote
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Haha, this is a fiery topic that I try to stay out of because I've only played the 3DS titles, but I'll take the bait here.
FE Fates: Birthright was the first title I've played from the series, and while I noticed some issues, I couldn't help but enjoy myself. The battle maps were cool. 2D characters were not as problematic as people made them out to be. The journey of taking a character with baseline attack and making them into a beast while they grow in a storyline was fun! I think the fire emblem fanbase can take themselves too seriously sometimes, which draws away from their experience in-game. Sometimes you just have to kick back instead of constantly lining each game up to its predecessors. Not that that's a wrong way to play a game (there is no wrong way to play).
fe heroes: 0139332753
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pixelatinate posted...
Haha, this is a fiery topic that I try to stay out of because I've only played the 3DS titles, but I'll take the bait here. I agree with you, on that last part. I always compare FE to Metroid because it also had a few major upgrades like FE throughout its time. I don't say the major upgrades are bad, but most people don't like it because it hurts the niche it was back in the day. Now FE is also for casuals and their isn't any permanent death anymore which was significant for older FE games, just like the end game bonus for Metroid that's now behind a pay wall. I just think the game industry only thinks of money now and not the games they put on the market. They want more people to play the games, but the core gets mad on these changes, because the base elements what made the games are just gone and they are replaced with new things. Times change and we need to change with the time, but eliminating base things out of a franchise being unchanged for almost 15 years is why people get mad. That's why we continually compare the new games to the old games, because the old games is we're most of the gamers started with.
I am the first one who claims that the next 2D Metroid game will be "Metroid Dread".
Signed on 24th of August, 2017 |
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DASHWOOD posted...
I never thought of it like this! I think I understand where some of the FE anger is coming from now.
fe heroes: 0139332753
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Awakening saved the entire series For starters, we don't like when people just mindlessly accept this statement because Daddy Nintendo said so without analyzing the statement and the sales of Shadow Dragon and New Mystery..... If 250k was all Awakening had to do, then Fire Emblem was in no danger of cancellation. Because the two games before Awakening did just that in Japan alone. And then Shadow Dragon sold at least another 250k in NA..... Nintendo just didn't get the message when we spoke with our wallets. PoR and RD sucked. That was the message. But no. They decided to make a game that's even worse than PoR and RD but added waifu mechanics. Well, too bad that strategy worked..... The complaints generally boils down to people liking FE before Nintendo started dumbing it down for Americans. Except that Mystery of the Emblem was the easiest game besides Gaiden before Sacred Stones came out, and that sold the best in Japan. But yes, they have dumbed the franchise down as of Sacred Stones. NOT AWAKENING. SACRED STONES. Awakening was my first Fire Emblem and since then I was hooked. And Awakening wasn't generic and lacking? Shadow Dragon does a better job of fleshing out all of its kingdoms than Awakening even does its four. Made all the more damning because Awakening is the same world as Shadow Dragon 2003 years later. There are things that warrant explanation. And yet..... Lucina has no personality when she's not lusting over Daddy and she's less relevant in the grand scheme of Awakening than Lyn was in Binding Blade. But she's the character they expect you to care about. Validar has no real backstory or motivation for wanting Grima the world destroyer to return. f***, Grima didn't have ANYTHING in Awakening its self. proper challenges like Conquest's Lunatic Recruit Josephine or pair Xander and Charlotte together. That's all it takes to destroy lolConquest. And IS tried to tell us that s*** was aimed at "Fire Emblem veterans"..... ha.
I may not agree with what you have to say, but I will fight to the death for my right to fight you to the death. -Stephen Colbert
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Endgame posted...
But yes, they have dumbed the franchise down as of Sacred Stones. NOT AWAKENING. SACRED STONES. Blazing Blade was technically where the first signs of it began, starting with the mandatory tutorial session and the game treating you like you're watching a preschool "talk to the audience" show. Power-creep on your own units compared to enemies and removing same-turn reinforcements only gimped things more in favor of the casual player.
(edited 21 hours ago)quote
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That is a good question, why are modern Fire Emblem fans so elitist?
I keep on seeing complaints like "Old fans keep on complaining about the new games! WAAA!" They start with Awakening and believe it's the best in series without even playing the games considered to be the best in the franchise or consider the hundreds of posts detailing the many flaws of the modern games. I just wish we could all stop being such douchebags is all. Okay. This post is partially a joke. I have no issues with anyone loving Awakening/Fates or even saying it's their favorite. But ya'll are just as bad as the classic fans.
(edited 21 hours ago)quote
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Maetch posted...
removing same-turn reinforcements only gimped things more in favor of the casual player. Nah, that was a terrific design decision, albeit they only used it properly in Conquest Hard/Lunatic where you still feel an intense despair despite your units having an extra turn to reinforce their defenses.
And the Lord [...] drive out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron.
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Endgame posted...
Awakening saved the entire series If you don't see that Lucina has personality, that's your own fault. She has tons of it, which is what drew me to love her in the first place. I can't speak for the other characters, but if anything, Lucina was one of the strongest points in the game and deserves all the praise she gets.
Come at me!
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Falchion92 posted...
If you don't see that Lucina has personality, that's your own fault. She has tons of it I still want to see those Groucho Marx glasses she was originally going to wear as her disguise. |
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Maetch posted...
Falchion92 posted...If you don't see that Lucina has personality, that's your own fault. She has tons of it I love the mask they used though. It symbolizes her perfectly.
Come at me!
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Falchion92 posted...
Maetch posted...Falchion92 posted...If you don't see that Lucina has personality, that's your own fault. She has tons of it She only wore it because Severa suggested it over the aforementioned Groucho glasses. Bear in mind that Lucina has absolutely no taste in fashion.
(edited 17 hours ago)quote
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Maetch posted...
Falchion92 posted...Maetch posted...Falchion92 posted...If you don't see that Lucina has personality, that's your own fault. She has tons of it I know she doesn't, which make sme love her adorkablness all the more. She isn't as perfect as she appears. I also love how she has a close relationship with her father. Who wouldn't after losing him before and not being able to stop it?
Come at me!
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RoyalDroneX posted...
they also spit on people who played Sacred Stones or anything that's not Shadow Dragon or Geneology/Theracia776 Practically no one likes Shadow Dragon besides a few, I've never seen someone look down on fans for NOT playing that game. |
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Blue Bomber 99 posted...
I don't quite understand, if you enjoy the games/series, what does it matter what other people think or say? |
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Hipsters obviously. Every franchise has them.
Just remember ALL CAPS when you spell the man name!
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old fire emblem fanbase pre awakening was possibly one of the most entertaining fan bases on the internet. post awakening fan base is pretty bottom of the barrel. Theres a lot of salt from old vets be it fan base related or pointed at the games them selves. im not like totally against the newer games although i really don't like fates mostly cause the story was written so laughably bad to the point where i would have had more faith in my writing in like middle school to make a better plot that the garbage that is fate`s story.
Competitive smash Player , random gaming news, + game dev stuff. Follow me on twitter @helldew93 #shamelessselfpromotion
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