- Boards
- Pokemon Sun
- I don't think I understand the deal over hacked pokemon anymore
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I hate making a deal about hacked pokemon. but I give up trying to understand exactly what is the general opinion with hacked pokemon anymore. Because some people do like to cheat but only in single player, but there are people who are VERY anti cheat, even if it's single player. Hell, the anti cheat people even don't want a mostly legitimate event mythical pokemon (since even Bank allows you to keep them or something).
I don't understand what the deal is with people's opinion on hacked pokemon anymore and I give up. Because it's either; a) cheating is wrong in games. You should never cheat whether it's multiplayer or single player b) there is nothing wrong with cheating as long you only do it in single player b) not all hacked pokemon are THAT bad, as long as they're mostly legitimate d) some other different reasons I'm starting to wonder if I should just ignore people's opinion and just play Pokémon games however I feel like whether it's playing it legitimately or cheating as long as it's single player only. Because while I cheat in games I have the morals to do it in single player only. Off topic: okay since I'm talking about cheating and someone will bring it up (because it always happens everytime I try to make honest questions and topics about cheating in games), yes my name is cheatermaster. Yes, it's weird I'm making a deal over cheating. |
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play how you like and don't care if some people get mad at how you play. and if someone plays with mons genned online as long as they have legal stats they could get ingame then who cares? not physically hurting people. inb4 some tryhard comes in and says it does when it doesn't
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Fc: 5258 3034 6289 Kevin |
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Oh, you mean I should ignore what people think and play a game however I feel like, whether it's legitimate or cheating in a game (only in single player of course, I at least have the morals to not do it multiplayer)? Because I sometimes wonder if this is why I sometimes make a deal over people's opinion on hacked pokemon; because I keep letting people's opinion get to me. Especially the anti cheat and anti hacker people.
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Hacking is what it is and basically is here to stay, I pop things up on GTS and ask for 91+ Legendaries and get 6IV Shiny Level 100s back eventually. I know that they've got to be hackmons but I don't care, I'm not hacking the damn things. As far as I'm concerned I got them through a legitimate in-game avenue. Some younger players would have no clue and just think they lucked out, and that's fine.
I don't have the time or motivation to purchase older games to hunt down different legendaries, rebreed in a previous gen to get gated off move tutor moves, and even complete multiple playthroughs to have different natures on my legendary pokemon. Hackers are alright in my book!
PSN- JesterCals ;
Youtube- https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCj8sDiteEVofR_6iQokrQYA |
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Nabiki_Tendo posted...
the hacking is not really the big issue the issue to me is that hackers call people who rfuse to hack no lifers just because they actually want to work for things instead of being lazy I'm not even a hacker, but what's with the constant insinuations and snipes over personal character over some digital monsters that are indistinguishable from the real thing? Be proud of your work ethic over some bits and bytes, I guess.
I'm sure someone who loves hearing themselves talk will be in to help you out shortly -VanilleHopen
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Ecclesiastes273 posted...
I'm not even a hacker, but what's with the constant insinuations and snipes over personal character over some digital monsters that are indistinguishable from the real thing? Be proud of your work ethic over some bits and bytes, I guess. Because spinning around in circles isn't how you play the game about battling monsters.
"Murder of the living is tragic, but murder of the idea is unforgivable." - Janus, speaker of the synod
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cheatermaster posted...
Oh, you mean I should ignore what people think and play a game however I feel like, whether it's legitimate or cheating in a game (only in single player of course, I at least have the morals to not do it multiplayer)? Because I sometimes wonder if this is why I sometimes make a deal over people's opinion on hacked pokemon; because I keep letting people's opinion get to me. Especially the anti cheat and anti hacker people. Some people care, some people don't. Its just how it is, like everything in this world there is always going to be more than one side to any given problem, those who agree, those who don't agree and those who can't provide an answer, so in the middle. You get the point I'm sure. It will always be a deal to some and others not, and you may not understand it but we all have different view points on things and different OPINIONS to back up ourselves up, notice I didn't say facts, just opinions. Thats all this is an opinion, and since thats all it is, it doesn't mean much; only to me and maybe others who might agree. There is no definite way to convince people to believe it's wrong to one but not to another, or visa versa. Don't let opinions get to you as when it comes to stuff like this there is always an opposer, just chose your side accordingly. Yep I ranted, my bad, I do that a lot :P
FC: 2449-5982-9013
Sun Name: A-Storm, Omega Ruby: A-Omega, Ultra Moon(When it's out): A-Omega |
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Nabiki_Tendo posted...
the hacking is not really the big issue the issue to me is that hackers call people who rfuse to hack no lifers just because they actually want to work for things instead of being lazy This.
Favourite JRPG's: The Last Story, Xenoblade Chronicles, Arc Rise Fantasia.
N3DS FC: 2208 9375 0944 / Nintendo Switch FC: SW-0594-6453-0420 |
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"Hackers are lazy people that debalance the game, Nintendo clearly dislikes this and the game should be played as intended with effort being rewarded. Hacked Pokemon are hacked no matter what. Besides cheating is wrong."
or "This game is about battling and finding strategies, not egg simulator 2017. If the hacked Pokemon are the same as the legit Pokemon does it really matter...? Running around for days is just stupid if it can be done more efficiently." Just pick a side you can be correct and the other side can be wrong. |
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Thanks everyone. I feel that I should do whatever I want and not let other people's opinion tell me otherwise. If I want to cheat, then I'll cheat, but I will have the morals to do it single player only. Even I don't wanna ruin other people's fun when it comes with multiplayer.
And since I won't let people's opinion tell me what I should do and what not to do, I'm not gonna care if any of my pokemon are hacked anymore. Like I don't care if my Diancie or Hoopa or Volcanion or any other mythical are hacked. As long as they're legitimate enough with legal stats, moves, and abilities, then good enough for me. Besides, I just can't figure when Game Freak and Nintendo would release them cause it's always random when they get released. |
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Nabiki_Tendo posted...
the hacking is not really the big issue the issue to me is that hackers call people who rfuse to hack no lifers just because they actually want to work for things instead of being lazy Tauros simulator isn't work though, it's just tedious grinding against RNG. It could take one egg to get what you want, it could take one thousand. Absolutely no skill involved.
3DS FC: 2895-6975-8311
IGN: Gymbro Jones |
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The problem for me is that because I don't want illegitimate Pokemon, I can't do any online trading safely. If people just kept their hacks to themselves or only traded them directly to people who want them, I'd be fine with it. But when I release my third definitely hacked shiny from WT, I just have to sigh.
Hack all you want, but please don't interfere with my game using systems that specifically subvert the intent of the designers, unless I ask you to. I'm not above cheating when I play games if it improves my experience, but I'd rather do it on purpose.
Warning: User is known to the state of California to get preachy.
Official - You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. |
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ghost_tails posted...
The problem for me is that because I don't want illegitimate Pokemon, I can't do any online trading safely. If people just kept their hacks to themselves or only traded them directly to people who want them, I'd be fine with it. But when I release my third definitely hacked shiny from WT, I just have to sigh. Breed your own team. Problem solved.
"Murder of the living is tragic, but murder of the idea is unforgivable." - Janus, speaker of the synod
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Lexifox posted...
Breed your own team. Problem solved. I do breed my own team, but that doesn't magically let me use Wonder Trade and the GTS without fear of getting hacks.
Warning: User is known to the state of California to get preachy.
Official - You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. |
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This is a very simple topic.
If you hack offline and for your own enjoyment, then do whatever you want. It does not affect me, i will not chastise you for doing so. However, if you use hacked mons to trade or to compete online, or participate in tournaments, you suck, end of. There is no ifs and buts, you are cheating and using those cheats against other players. Ergo, you are a piece of MissingNo. Pokémon (Main series) is not a fighting game, you have Pokkén for that. Pokémon is a level/stat based classic roleplaying game with an online competitive component. And like in all online RPG/MMO/Whateveryoufancytocall it, leveling and raising stats is a critical part of the experience and an intended time-sink that makes forming teams a committed effort. Not only that, the time sink is also intended so that it´s unrealistic that any one single player can prepare for all eventualities for an upcoming competition and thus, to the skill in battle, it adds also layers of luck, preparation, build and trends vs inventive to the competition. Your personal opinion on this genre or type of gameplay means absolutely zero because you still chose to play this kind of game fully knowing what it entailed. With your cheating, you do not need to spend time and effort in order to build yourself perfect builds and perfect teams to counter any and every situation and build which you could never have by playing the game as it was intended. Thus, you are altering the competition. A lot of people argue that "In the end, even if i hack, if i win or lose is based on my skill as a player" but skill as a player and combat experience is meant to be only ONE HALF of the Pokémon experience. Again, Pokémon is not a fighting game, rpgs have many factors beyond your mastery of gameplay and you are basically jumping all over the rest of factors to focus on the one you happen to like the best. It does not matter how much you try to spin the wheel, the simple fact is that you are a cheater, you are altering the competition unfairly and you do not deserve to participate. Who the hell are you to decide that half of the game should not matter and the game should focus exclusively on the part that you find appealing? And in doing so, you are indirectly forcing everyone else to do the same because if they do not then they are in clear disadvantage towards someone who basically has every single Pokémon, item and build at the reach of their fingertips. If you have ever participated or seen competitions of Warhammer, Magic or any other game before the age of competitive videogaming, you would know what i am talking about. Yes, being good at the game was a big factor but surprises, inventive builds and secret strategies thought and planned before a big fight or tournament were constant factors that made everything exciting and unpredictable. And many of these were based on the fact that everyone had different cards/figurines and everyone had to deal with what they had and do the best they could with the tools they could get their hands on. And cheating has killed these factors in a big degree. I am not saying these factors are COMPLETELY gone and there is still some space for inventive and surprise but it´s effects have been BRUTALLY diminished from a 50/50 to easily 80/20 and this is unfair, uncalled for, and a direct and undeniable result of people cheating their way into perfection. You simply cannot deny that cheating has changed the face of competition, and while many may think it´s a "positive" change t´s still a change that should have never occurred as the game presented you with a certain type of gameplay that you thought you were 2cool4. |
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Pokémon (Main series) is not a fighting game, you have Pokkén for that.
Give this guy a medal. He just compared two completely different games. And like in all online RPG/MMO/Whateveryoufancytocall it, leveling and raising stats is a critical part of the experience and an intended time-sink that makes forming teams a committed effort. Critical flaw in your argument: the time-sink of the pokemon games takes the committed effort of a robot (egg hatching+EV training), unlike other MMOs, where there's usually some skill involved in raiding dungeons for gear. Thus, pokemon is not the same as the other MMOs as there's huge differences between training (grinding) and actual battling. Not only that, the time sink is also intended so that it´s unrealistic that any one single player can prepare for all eventualities for an upcoming competition and thus, to the skill in battle, it adds also layers of luck, preparation, build and trends vs inventive to the competition. Only IVs are unrealistic, which is the one part I agree with. Everything else is far from impossible. More below. With your cheating, you do not need to spend time and effort in order to build yourself perfect builds and perfect teams to counter any and every situation and build which you could never have by playing the game as it was intended. There are no perfect teams unless you know the opposing team beforehand and can change yours accordingly. Who the hell are you to decide that half of the game should not matter and the game should focus exclusively on the part that you find appealing? Gee, I'm only the one who bought my own game. Who the f*** are you to tell me what to do with it? That's just it, people will do whatever they want with their games without giving a f***. For every person you somehow manage to convince to quit cheating, ten others have just bought a cheating device. As much as every person is to blame for their own cheating, so are the developers to blame for the cheating of thousands (millions?) of players because they failed to provide appropriate counter-measures to cheating, time and time again. It's not even that hard: - Normalize IVs for online battles, or give the option to do it. It's an outdated system that is too hard to optimize and only adds a stupid out-of-battle random factor on top of everything else, but with extreme match-influencing potential. - More anti-cheating measures. I heard they could see hacked pokemon if they looked at the code back in the past gens, so it shouldn't be a problem to create an algorithm to do it on a large scale. |
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ghost_tails posted...
Lexifox posted...So... don't use GTS or WT? 'I want to trade but I don't want hacked stuff so no one should be allowed to do something I don't like' isn't exactly a tenable position to have.Breed your own team. Problem solved. LucarioSaga posted... The title of my novel is called 'Cheating is Bad, Mmkay?'and here's exhibit 2, 'I want to spend 9000 hours to get the best team I possibly can, so everyone should have to'. Honestly I've never played competitively bc people take it far too seriously. All I've ever cared about is filling the dex. So yeah, if I want a shiny deoxys or w/e, and I can tell on the GTS that it's clearly hacked, I'm still going to get it. Who cares? If you're a hardcore competitive tournament battler then yeah, absolutely expose every cheater you find, because at that point they are having a direct effect on your experience. But if you're just talking about people playing the game at all, see above: everyone is going to play how they want to. Personally I don't have the time to grind multiple gens, invest in old games I've already beaten, and figure out how to take older mons to gen vii, just to fill 800+ slots. In the many cases where it's easier to just search GTS than go through the whole exhausting process, I'm usually going to choose GTS (after all, finding specific mon you want is the whole reason GTS was created in the first place, no?). I already filled the dex in gens 1-4, so I'm not looking to take the hard way all over again. Should my copy of Moon be confiscated because I grabbed clearly hacked mons from the GTS, with no intention of ever battling online with them? I don't think so. Live and let live, I would say. |
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elysiontru posted...
ghost_tails posted...Lexifox posted...So... don't use GTS or WT? 'I want to trade but I don't want hacked stuff so no one should be allowed to do something I don't like' isn't exactly a tenable position to have.Breed your own team. Problem solved. That's not my position at all. My position is that there's no reason for anyone to trade hacked Pokemon anonymously. They only get anything out of it if they're using the GTS, in which case they can trade a hacked Pokemon for something else that they want. But if they're trading hacked Pokemon, why can't they just hack in the Pokemon that they actually want in the first place? And there's zero reason to trade on WT at all if you're using hacked Pokemon, literally all you're doing is tossing around random illegitimate Pokemon to people who may not want them. People who want to hack have easy ways to get the Pokemon they want. Why is it so hard to leave the ones who don't want to hack alone?
Warning: User is known to the state of California to get preachy.
Official - You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. |
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ksamos11 posted...
play how you like and don't care if some people get mad at how you play. and if someone plays with mons genned online as long as they have legal stats they could get ingame then who cares? not physically hurting people. inb4 some tryhard comes in and says it does when it doesn't Yes it does hurt people. You do better than them because you cheat. Try that with a baseball game or boxing match. Go adjust the values in your favor and see how they treat you. If you compete do it legit. Or go on showdown which is tailor made for that stuff anyway. |
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The only value they're truly manipulating is IVs.
While they're quite significant, let's not pretend they made their pokemon invulnerable and omnipotent. |
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The problem with genning pokemon inherently is not everybody can do it. Not everybody can homebrew their 3DS, and not everybody playing pokemon has access to a computer from which they could gen, or practice on showdown, and because of this they have to spend extra time creating a team; Thus they have less time to practice for the upcoming tournament/competition/ect. Also, as already mentioned it completely breaks the trading aspect of the game for people who would like to play legitimately.
The first problem could be completely eliminated if Gamefreak simply included a showdown-like feature in games, which would also help our second problem because less people would gen (but never eliminate it).
"Guns aren't for threats. They're for actions. Are you willing to risk your life?" ~ Eiichiro Oda
3DS FC: 4682-8978-0928 |
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cadcrafter posted...
not everybody playing pokemon has access to a computer from which they could gen, or practice on showdown, and because of this they have to spend extra time creating a team; Thus they have less time to practice for the upcoming tournament/competition/ect. On a side-note, that happens with a lot of competitive sports. Not everybody has access to a gym fitted to properly practice certain sports (especially the less popular ones) compared to some countries. Sad realities of our world. |
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Here is my stance I don't really care what you do when messing around with your friends or some random match on battle spot but if you decide you want to play competitively in any kind of tournament every Pokémon must be 100% legit (not even the offspring of hacked Pokémon should be allowed which means no using a hacked perfect ditto for breeding). You want to run hidden power ice on Koko then keep soft resetting, you want a legendary Pokémon optimized for trick room then keep soft resetting, you want to run wish on chansey well you missed the event so to bad etc.
I am legend
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gbchaosmaster posted...
cadcrafter posted...not everybody playing pokemon has access to a computer from which they could gen, or practice on showdown, and because of this they have to spend extra time creating a team; Thus they have less time to practice for the upcoming tournament/competition/ect. last time i check gym aren't illegal and the most excuse i've heard is (i've no time to breed) at least it doable before gen 6 or 5 they where no way to get perfect iv by breeding and you couldn't even check your iv and ev before and even now level100 can have their iv modified and breeding is maybe repetitive but long time consuming not really and anyway that what an rpg is you should have known you need to spend time having the best team like in practically every rpg
pokemon is life pokemon is love and god hair's green https://supermariomakerbookmark.nintendo.net/profile/toquidef?type=posted 3DS FC:2793-1334-8898
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I'm personally fine with hacking tbh. I personally don't hack, and breed and catch all the shiny by myself. Hacking to me isn't that big of a deal. Technically its still a violation, as Game Fraud doesn't allow 3rd party tools. But some people are so defensive about it, and there are also people who go out of their way and make this a witch hunt.
Previously before Gen 7, probably my only beef with hackers is that they can use perfect Legendaries. It is almost impossible for you to get a 5 IV with the correct Nature unless you have the luck of the gods and 50 million Master Balls to spare. Its even worse if its event only like the event Palkia Dialga with HA, and they were used in VGC. So anyone playing legit would have a veeeeeeeeeery hard time to fight on even grounds. Now I don't really care about any of that since we have Bottle Caps. Unless they make it an event mon that you can't synchronize the nature, and if it happened to be a Trick Room mon or something and you need 0 IVs in speed. That also requires godlike luck. Which is why I wish they would make a 0 IV Bottle Cap so that everyone who plays can have a chance to fight on even grounds. EDIT: What I'm trying to say is. The reason as to why hacking exists is because people do not have the commitment or the means to achieve the results that they want. Bottle caps are a step in the right direction, and I look forward to things like these that allows people to be able to more easily reach their goals without having to resort to using cheats or hacks.
Sven of the Outcast
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Do you even engrish?
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AuroraWave posted...
Cheating is cheating no matter the context. I hate cheaters. And they hate you! :D |
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I know I'm repeating, but I appreciate the more honest comments. Yeah, I'm starting to feel convinced that all I've done is let other people's opinion control me, telling me what to do and what not to do. From now on, I'm gonna do whatever I want and stop caring about other people's opinion. If I wanna do things the more honest and legitimate way, I'll do it. If I wanna cheat, I'll cheat all I want but I will only do it single player. Even I want people on multiplayer to have fun by not cheating.
So as far I'm concerned, I'm gonna stop caring if some of my pokemon were hacked or not. To me as far as I'm concerned all I care is that the hacked pokemon has legal stats, legal moves, and legal abilities to the point that they awre legitimate enough that even Pokemon Bank lets you keep them. I mean it did that with several hacked pokemon I got from a trade (one was Hoopa and another was Volcanion). |
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The real problem is that people who have time to breed Pokemon get angry at genners who can create what they can in supersonic speed.
My idea is this: There should be two leagues in competitive, one with Pokemon the player gens/creates (for In game purposes, it's called a battle simulator) Players with not enough time to breed Pokemon can enter PSS or play in VGC against other battle simulator teams. This league does not offer as much money as the second league (maybe 4/5 of the other's prize pool). Then there is the league for those with Pokemon bred and trained through only in game methods. This is for the players who want to get into the real nitty gritty and work on their teams for competitions. This league won't attract as many people, but there is no reason to hack Pokemon because it can be done faster in game, since it's the actual game. This league receives the full prize pool. This idea needs a few tweaks here and there but that's why it's the first idea. Any thoughts/improvements?
Shiny Pokemon are fun to trade! Hit me up for some Sun and Moon trades!
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- Boards
- Pokemon Sun
- I don't think I understand the deal over hacked pokemon anymore
