CBWL 021

Wrestling Observer Live – June 8, 2026

Dave Meltzer: Alright, we’ve been getting a ton of questions about this, so let’s just address it head-on. Over the last few days, CELEB BITCHES WRESTLING LEAGUE — yes, that’s apparently the official name now — has gone on an absolute signing spree. We’re talking dozens of big names. Beyoncé, Zendaya, Billie Eilish, Lauren Boebert, Marjorie Taylor Greene, Jennette McCurdy, Miranda Cosgrove, Bernadette from Big Bang Theory… I mean, the list just keeps going.

Bryan Alvarez: This is fucking insane, Dave. Like, actually insane. I don’t even know where to start with this. They just signed like half of Hollywood and a bunch of politicians. What the hell is even happening over there?

Dave: Well, from what we’ve heard, Talent Relations has been extremely busy. Jim Ross is apparently running point on a lot of these signings, and they’ve been throwing money at people. Some of these deals are apparently very lucrative.

Bryan: Yeah, but at what point does this stop being wrestling and just become “let’s see how many famous women we can get to do degrading shit on camera”? Because that’s what this feels like now. They signed Beyoncé. They signed Zendaya. These aren’t indie wrestlers who need the money. These are legitimate A-list celebrities.

Dave: It’s definitely crossed a line. I’ll say that. Even for CBWL, this feels different. The roster is now so bloated with mainstream names that I don’t know how they’re going to use all of them without it feeling like a circus.

Bryan: And let’s talk about the commentary team real quick, because that’s its own disaster. They’ve got Freddie Benson from iCarly doing play-by-play. Like, the actual character. This kid is supposed to be this naive, innocent guy calling matches where girls are getting shit on and throat-fucked. And then they’ve got Chelsea Handler as the color commentator who’s just gonna roast him the entire time, and Sofia Vergara doing this over-the-top horny bimbo thing with a ridiculous accent. This is not a wrestling commentary booth. This is performance art.

Dave: The Freddie Benson thing is… something. I’ll give them credit for commitment to the bit. But yeah, having this wide-eyed, wholesome kid calling these matches is going to be either brilliant or completely unwatchable depending on how they handle it.

Bryan: And the power structure rumors are getting even wilder. There’s this growing belief among the really online fans that Mariska Hargitay is basically Cowboy Watts’ girlfriend and that he’s bankrolling the whole thing just to keep her happy. It’s giving very strong Dixie Carter/TNA vibes, except somehow even more unhinged.

Dave: I don’t know how true any of that is, but it’s definitely the narrative that’s sticking right now. And with how many big names they just signed, people are starting to wonder if this whole thing is even sustainable. How do you book that many celebrities without it turning into complete chaos?

Bryan: You don’t. That’s the thing. This isn’t a wrestling roster anymore. This is a fetish content roster with some wrestling presentation sprinkled on top. And I don’t know how they follow this up without either going even more extreme or completely losing the plot.

Dave: Yeah… it’s going to be very interesting to see what they do with all these new signings. Because right now, it feels like they’ve bitten off way more than they can chew.

Bryan: I’ll say this though — if nothing else, they’ve got everyone talking. Whether that’s a good thing or a bad thing… we’ll see.

*COMMERCIAL FOR BLUE CHEW*

Bryan Alvarez: Alright, let’s talk about the power structure, because this is where it gets really stupid. There’s this growing rumor — and it’s getting louder — that Cowboy Watts is the real shot caller behind the scenes, and that Mariska Hargitay is basically just his girlfriend who wanted to stay on TV after SVU ended. So he supposedly created this whole company as a vanity project to keep her happy. It’s giving very strong “Dixie Carter’s dad bankrolling TNA” energy.

Dave Meltzer: Yeah, that narrative has really taken off in the last week or so. A lot of the really online fans are convinced that Mariska is just the public face, and that Cowboy Watts is the one actually pulling the strings. Some of them are even saying he’s funding the whole operation himself.

Bryan: And if that’s true, it explains a lot. Because nothing about this company makes any business sense. Who signs Beyoncé, Zendaya, and Lauren Boebert in the same week? Someone who doesn’t actually care about making money in a traditional sense. Someone who’s doing this for personal reasons.

Dave: The part that’s even weirder is the creative side. There’s this rumor that there’s someone even above Cowboy when it comes to creative. Some people are calling him “Mr. Nasty” online, but nobody really knows who that is. The story is that Cowboy publicly refers to creative as a “committee,” but in reality it’s just one guy calling the shots.

Bryan: This whole thing is so convoluted. You’ve got Cowboy Watts booking the shows, some mysterious “Mr. Nasty” supposedly running creative, Stanley Kubrick doing production, Colonel Parker handling contracts, Steve Jobs doing marketing… it’s like they went out of their way to collect the most random group of people possible and put them in charge of a wrestling company. And now they’ve got Dan Schneider running developmental? Come on.

Dave: It’s definitely one of the strangest power structures I’ve ever seen in wrestling. Even for CBWL, this feels excessive. Usually these companies at least try to have some structure that makes sense on paper. This one feels like it was designed to be as chaotic as possible.

Bryan: And the scary part is, it might actually work for them in the short term. Because the more ridiculous it gets, the more people talk about it. But long term? I don’t see how this doesn’t completely collapse under its own weight. You can’t have that many big egos and weird personalities running things without it blowing up eventually.

Dave: I’m curious how much of this is even real versus how much is just online speculation that’s gotten out of control. But either way, the perception is becoming the reality. A lot of people now genuinely believe that Cowboy Watts is the shadow ruler of CBWL and that Mariska is just there for show.

Bryan: And if that’s the case, then this whole “Mr. Nasty” thing makes even less sense. Who the hell is actually in charge of creative then? Because if it’s not Cowboy, and it’s not Mariska, then who is it?

Dave: That’s the million-dollar question right now. And honestly? I don’t think we’re going to get a real answer anytime soon. This company loves operating in the shadows.

Bryan: Yeah. And the longer they keep it mysterious, the more unhinged the rumors are gonna get. *COMMERCIAL; DRUNK RIC FLAIR PLUGS DRAFTKINGS*

Bryan Alvarez: Okay, but here’s what I really don’t understand — how the hell did they get Jim Ross to sign on with this shit? Like, out of every wrestling personality they could’ve brought in to run Talent Relations, they got JR? The guy who spent decades building credibility in this business. What the fuck is he doing working for CELEB BITCHES WRESTLING LEAGUE?

Dave Meltzer: I’ve been thinking about that too. And I think there’s a couple of layers to it. First of all, CBWL has some legitimate Hollywood connections now. That’s not speculation anymore. With the amount of mainstream celebrities they’ve been pulling in lately, it’s clear they have some kind of pipeline into that world. And if they’re working on some kind of bigger TV deal — which I’ve heard rumors about — then bringing in someone like Jim Ross makes a lot more sense from a business standpoint.

Bryan: A TV deal? With who? What network is touching this?

Dave: I don’t know yet. But the fact that they’ve been able to sign people like Beyoncé and Zendaya tells me they’ve got some serious backing behind the scenes. And if they’re positioning themselves as this edgy, celebrity-driven thing that could potentially cross over… then having Jim Ross as the face of Talent Relations gives them some legitimacy with wrestling fans. Even if the product itself is completely detached from wrestling at this point.

Bryan: Okay, but come on. You really think JR signed on just because they have “Hollywood connections”? This guy has been around forever. He knows exactly what this company is.

Dave: I’m not saying that’s the only reason. But think about it — JR has been pushing his BBQ sauces pretty hard for years now. The Main Event Mustard, the whole line. And let’s be honest, he’s never really had a massive mainstream platform to move that stuff. CBWL, for all its problems, is getting a ton of attention right now. If they’re offering him a prominent role and a bigger stage to sell his products… that might’ve been part of the pitch.

Bryan: So you’re telling me Jim Ross joined CELEB BITCHES WRESTLING LEAGUE so he could sell more barbecue sauce?

Dave: I’m saying it’s probably part of it. These companies know how to sweeten the deal. You dangle the money, you dangle the platform, you dangle the Hollywood connections… and suddenly a guy who’s been in wrestling for forty years is working for a promotion where girls are getting shit on in porta-potties on live TV.

Bryan: That’s depressing as hell.

Dave: It is what it is. At the end of the day, everybody’s got a price. And if CBWL is offering JR more money and more visibility than he’s had in years — plus the chance to move more Main Event Mustard — then yeah, I can see why he took the job.

Bryan: God. Main Event Mustard. That’s what it comes down to. Jim Ross is helping run Talent Relations for the most depraved wrestling company in existence… so he can sell barbecue sauce.

Dave: Welcome to 2026. *COMMERCIAL FOR SURFSHARK*

Dave Meltzer: Alright, let’s just go through some of these people one by one, because the more you look at who’s actually running things behind the scenes at CBWL, the more ridiculous it gets.

Bryan Alvarez: Please. Let’s do it. Start with whoever you want, because this whole thing is a mess.

Dave: Let’s start with Stanley Kubrick as Head of Production and TV. This one actually makes a strange kind of sense if you think about it. Kubrick was always known for being obsessive about visuals and control. If CBWL wants the shows to look cinematic and disturbing — which they clearly do — then putting someone like him in charge of production isn’t the worst idea they’ve ever had.

Bryan: Yeah, but it’s still insane. You’ve got one of the most legendary film directors of all time directing porta-potty matches and gloryhole segments. It’s like using a Ferrari to deliver pizzas. The fact that they even got him is crazy, but the fact that he apparently wanted to do it? That’s what scares me.

Dave: Next up — Colonel Parker running Legal and Contracts. This one feels very on-brand for them. Parker was known for being ruthless and extremely protective of his clients’ money… while also taking a huge cut for himself. If CBWL is signing all these big names and trying to lock them into extremely one-sided, dangerous contracts, then having someone like Parker in that role makes perfect sense from their perspective.

Bryan: It also explains why so many of these celebrities are probably signing deals they’re going to regret. Parker was famous for trapping Elvis in terrible contracts. Imagine what he’s doing to these girls now.

Dave: Then you’ve got Steve Jobs running Marketing and PR. This one feels like the most “we’re trying to look cool” move they’ve made. They clearly want CBWL to feel like more than just a sleazy wrestling promotion. They want it to feel modern, stylish, and culturally relevant. Putting Steve Jobs in charge of that image is a very deliberate choice.

Bryan: It’s also completely detached from reality. Steve Jobs was a control freak who obsessed over every little detail of Apple’s image. Now he’s supposedly helping market a company where girls are getting publicly degraded on live TV. It doesn’t add up unless they’re trying to rebrand extreme fetish content as some kind of edgy, high-concept art project.

Dave: Sheri L. Dew as CFO is interesting too. She’s got that very polished, corporate, “wholesome” background from her time in the Mormon church. Having her in charge of the money while this company does the most depraved shit imaginable creates this weird contrast. It almost feels intentional — like they want that moral hypocrisy baked into the structure.

Bryan: Yeah, that one feels very CBWL. They love that kind of dark irony. The person handling the finances is someone who, on paper, should be completely against everything the company stands for.

Dave: And then there’s Dan Schneider running Developmental. This one is probably the most disturbing on the list. Given his history and reputation, putting him in charge of young talent — especially young women — feels like an incredibly bad look. Even by CBWL standards, this one stands out as particularly gross.

Bryan: It’s not even subtle. They basically put the guy with the worst reputation in the room in charge of the young girls. And they’re acting like that’s normal. That tells you everything you need to know about how little they care about optics or safety.

Dave: It’s also another example of how this power structure seems designed to be as chaotic and controversial as possible. They’re not even trying to hide how fucked up some of these choices are.

Bryan: Because at this point, the controversy is the product. The more unhinged the behind-the-scenes stuff gets, the more people talk about CBWL. Whether that’s sustainable long-term is another question entirely.

Dave: Yeah. Right now it feels like they’re playing with fire and enjoying how close they can get to burning everything down. *AUDIO TECH MEANT TO INSERT COMMERCIAL HERE, BUT DIDNT....* *45 SECONDS OF DEAD AIR, MOST PEOPLE THINK THE STREAM IS BUFFERING AND TUNE OUT*

Bryan Alvarez: Let’s talk about the people actually doing the dirty work under Jim Ross, because this is where it gets even weirder. We’ve got Arnold Palmer and Elena Ceaușescu listed as his co-persons in Talent Relations. Like… what the fuck?

Dave Meltzer: This one’s interesting. Arnold Palmer being involved makes a strange kind of sense if you look at it from a pure “old school wrestling guy doing whatever needs to be done” perspective. He’s been around forever, he’s respected, and he’s the kind of person who can walk into a room and get people to at least hear him out. Even if he’s showing up on a Greyhound bus to sign Chelsea Handler.

Bryan: The Greyhound bus thing is still insane to me. They sent a legendary golfer on a fucking Greyhound to go sign a celebrity for this company. That’s not how serious organizations operate. That’s how a bunch of degenerates with too much money operate.

Dave: It does feel very CBWL though. They clearly don’t care about looking professional in the traditional sense. They’re leaning into the absurdity. And Arnold Palmer fits that energy. He’s old, he’s respected, but he’s also willing to do whatever weird job they throw at him without complaining too much.

Bryan: Now Elena Ceaușescu… that one’s actually kind of scary. From everything we’ve heard, she’s the one who’s been handling some of the more difficult or reluctant signings. And from what people are saying, she’s cold as hell. No small talk, no charm, just straight pressure and intimidation. That fits her reputation.

Dave: Yeah. If Arnold Palmer is the “reasonable old guy who shows up and tries to make a deal,” then Elena is the one they send when they want to make it clear that this isn’t really a negotiation. She’s there to get the signature, one way or another.

Bryan: It’s also another example of how this company seems to deliberately choose the most unhinged or inappropriate people for certain roles. Why is the wife of a former communist dictator doing Talent Relations for a celebrity fetish wrestling promotion? It doesn’t make any sense unless they’re specifically trying to create this weird, unsettling atmosphere behind the scenes.

Dave: I think that’s part of the appeal for them. Everything about CBWL feels like it was designed to be uncomfortable. The on-screen product is uncomfortable, the power structure is uncomfortable, and even the people doing the day-to-day work feel like characters from a dark comedy rather than actual professionals.

Bryan: And Jim Ross is sitting on top of all of it. The guy who spent his entire career being the voice of reason in wrestling is now running Talent Relations for a company where one of his main helpers is a Cold War-era dictator’s wife and the other one gets sent on Greyhound buses to sign comedians. How does he even justify this to himself?

Dave: Money, platform, and barbecue sauce. Like we said earlier. At a certain point, you just accept the absurdity and cash the checks.

Bryan: Yeah. I guess when you’ve been in this business as long as JR has, you stop being surprised by anything. Even if that “anything” includes signing half of Hollywood to a company that’s basically softcore porn with wrestling moves.

Dave: Welcome to CELEB BITCHES WRESTLING LEAGUE. *ANTI-GAMBLING COMMERCIAL PSA - EUGENE SAYS HE LOST HIS HOUSE ON FANDUEL*

Dave Meltzer: One thing that’s been making the rounds is how Arnold Palmer actually went about signing Chelsea Handler. From what I’ve been told, they sent him on a Greyhound bus to go meet her. Which, if true, is one of the most ridiculous things I’ve heard in a while.

Bryan Alvarez: Wait, hold on. A Greyhound bus? That can’t be right. Who the fuck sends a legendary athlete on a Greyhound bus to sign a celebrity for a wrestling company?

Dave: That’s what I was told. Apparently they didn’t want to spend the money on a flight or a car service, so they just put him on a Greyhound and sent him on his way. Classic CBWL.

Bryan: That doesn’t sound right to me. I’ve heard from a couple of people that it wasn’t a Greyhound at all. Are you sure about that?

Dave: Well, I’m going off the information I was given. But now that you mention it, maybe it wasn’t a regular Greyhound. Let me think… I believe it was actually one of those old Partridge Family buses. You know, the ones with the big flower on the side. That’s what they used to send him.

Bryan: A Partridge Family bus? Dave, come on. Now you’re just making shit up. First it was a Greyhound, now it’s a fucking Partridge Family bus? Which one is it?

Dave: No, no, hear me out. I think the original information I got was slightly off. It wasn’t a standard Greyhound. It was a converted Partridge Family-style bus that they use for talent transport sometimes. That’s why it stuck in my head as a Greyhound — because it’s still a big bus, just with different branding.

Bryan: So now it’s a flower-covered hippie bus from a 1970s sitcom? This is getting more ridiculous by the second. Who told you this?

Dave: I’m not going to name sources, but I will say the information has been consistent enough that I feel comfortable reporting it. Whether it was a Greyhound or a Partridge Family bus, the point stands — they sent Arnold Palmer on some kind of long-distance bus to go sign Chelsea Handler instead of just flying him out like a normal company would.

Bryan: You’re really gonna die on this hill, huh?

Dave: I’m just reporting what I’ve been told. And what I’ve been told is that Arnold Palmer took a bus — whether it had flowers on it or not — to go handle that signing. That’s the story.

Bryan: This company is so stupid that I almost believe it. A Partridge Family bus. Jesus Christ.

Dave Meltzer: Another part of this power structure that doesn’t get talked about enough is the group of behind-the-scenes producers and agents they have working under Cowboy Watts. From what I’ve been told, there’s a small but very strange collection of people handling deals and talent relations behind the curtain. We’re talking about people like Sarah Palin, Joan Rivers, Bill Parcells, and Tony Soprano.

Bryan Alvarez: Hold on. Tony Soprano? The guy from The Sopranos? You’re telling me he’s actually working as an agent for CELEB BITCHES WRESTLING LEAGUE?

Dave: That’s what I’ve heard. And it actually makes a weird kind of sense if you think about it. If they’re trying to strong-arm certain celebrities into signing or keeping them in line once they’re under contract, having someone with that kind of reputation and presence could be useful. Whether it’s kayfabe or not, the threat of Tony Soprano being involved in your deal is probably pretty effective.

Bryan: This company is so stupid. They’ve got a fictional mafia boss working as a talent agent. What’s next, they’re gonna have him breaking legs if girls don’t want to do the scat matches?

Dave: I don’t know how literal it is, but the fact that he’s listed in that group tells me they’re leaning into that image. Then you’ve got Joan Rivers in there too, which makes sense from a different angle. She was always known for being sharp, mean, and very good at reading people. If they need someone who can verbally destroy talent or negotiate hard, she’d be effective.

Bryan: And Sarah Palin? What the hell is she doing there?

Dave: That one’s more political. She brings a certain kind of controversial, culture-war energy that CBWL seems to enjoy leaning into. Having her involved behind the scenes probably helps with some of the more politically charged signings, like Lauren Boebert or Marjorie Taylor Greene. She might be the one helping broker those kinds of deals or managing the heat that comes with them.

Bryan: And Bill Parcells? The football coach?

Dave: Parcells has that old-school, tough love, “I’m in charge” personality. If they need someone to crack the whip on some of the more difficult or high-maintenance talent, he could serve that role. It’s another example of them collecting very different types of personalities and throwing them all into the same chaotic machine.

Bryan: So let me get this straight. You’ve got a mafia boss, a legendary insult comic, a controversial former politician, and an NFL coach all working as agents and producers behind the scenes of this company. And on top of that, you’ve got Stanley Kubrick doing production, Dan Schneider running developmental, and Jim Ross’s helpers include a famous golfer and a dictator’s wife.

Dave: That’s the current power structure, yeah.

Bryan: This isn’t a wrestling company anymore. This is performance art. Or a very expensive shitpost that somehow got millions of dollars behind it.

Dave: It’s definitely one of the strangest collections of people I’ve ever seen running anything in wrestling. And somehow, it all seems to be working — at least for now.

Bryan: God help us all. *COMMERCIAL FOR - REPLACEMENT REMOTES DOT COM*

Bryan Alvarez: You know what, let me just go through this list again because I need to hear it out loud to believe it. We’ve got Stanley Kubrick doing production. Colonel Parker handling legal. Steve Jobs running marketing. Sheri L. Dew as CFO. Dan Schneider running developmental. Tony Soprano as some kind of behind-the-scenes agent. Sarah Palin, Joan Rivers, and Bill Parcells also working as producers and agents. John Wick and Butterbean running security. Larry David as head referee. And now you’re telling me Sterling Marlin is in charge of transport and international touring?

Dave Meltzer: That’s correct.

Bryan: Sterling Marlin? The NASCAR driver? The guy whose entire career was driving cars in circles? They made him the head of transport for a wrestling company? What, because he knows how to drive fast?

Dave: From what I understand, yes. They put him in charge of all the buses, trucks, and logistics for getting talent and equipment from show to show. And apparently he’s also handling the international touring side now too.

Bryan: This is so fucking stupid. Out of every possible person they could’ve put in charge of making sure the trucks show up on time, they picked a retired NASCAR driver. And they gave him international touring on top of it? What does Sterling Marlin know about running tours in Japan or Europe? Has he ever even left the country for work?

Dave: Apparently Cowboy Watts likes him. And in CBWL, that seems to be the main qualification for getting a job these days.

Bryan: I just… I can’t wrap my head around this company anymore. You’ve got one of the greatest film directors of all time directing porta-potty matches. You’ve got a mafia boss negotiating contracts. You’ve got Dan Schneider in charge of young female talent. And now Sterling Marlin is driving the buses. This isn’t a power structure. This is performance art. This is a shitpost that somehow got a budget.

Dave: It’s definitely one of the most bizarre collections of people I’ve ever seen running a wrestling promotion. There’s no logic to it. It’s almost like they went out of their way to pick the most random, inappropriate people possible for every role.

Bryan: And the crazy part is, it’s working. People are talking about this company nonstop. Whether that’s because it’s good or because it’s a complete clown show is up for debate, but they’ve got everyone’s attention right now.

Dave: That might be the only thing keeping this whole operation together at this point.

Bryan Alvarez: Alright, I need to know what the hell it’s like backstage with all these people. Because if you actually stop and think about who’s running this company behind the scenes, it’s completely insane. You’ve got Cowboy Watts, Stanley Kubrick, Colonel Parker, Tony Soprano, Dan Schneider, Sheri L. Dew, Steve Jobs, Larry David, John Wick, Butterbean, Sterling Marlin… how the fuck does any of this work? How do these people not kill each other?

Dave Meltzer: That’s actually a really good question. Because on paper, this group should not be able to function at all. The personalities are way too different. But I think there’s probably a weird kind of ecosystem that’s developed.

Bryan: Start with Tony Soprano and Colonel Parker. Those two have to get along, right? They’re both old-school “business at all costs” types. I could see them actually respecting each other.

Dave: I think they probably do get along, at least on a surface level. They’re both very direct, very transactional people. If there’s money or leverage involved, they’re probably on the same page more often than not. The real tension probably comes when someone like Stanley Kubrick gets involved.

Bryan: Oh god, Kubrick. That guy probably hates everyone. He’s a notorious perfectionist and control freak. I can’t imagine him getting along with Cowboy Watts or Tony Soprano. He’d be trying to make every segment look like a movie and everyone else would just want to get the show done.

Dave: Yeah, Kubrick is probably the most isolated person in the whole structure. He might only really communicate with Cowboy Watts when he has to, and even then it’s probably tense. Everyone else probably just tries to stay out of his way.

Bryan: What about Dan Schneider? How has he not gotten his ass kicked yet?

Dave: That’s the interesting one. I think a lot of people probably avoid him. From what I’ve heard, he mostly deals with developmental and stays in his own lane. But I wouldn’t be surprised if there’s a lot of quiet resentment toward him, especially from some of the women who came through that system.

Bryan: And Larry David? That poor bastard has to be miserable. He’s surrounded by absolute lunatics and he’s supposed to be in charge of the referees. I can picture him just standing there with his arms crossed, looking exhausted while everyone around him argues about who gets to shit on who this week.

Dave: Larry’s probably the most normal person in the entire power structure, which says a lot. He’s probably just trying to do his job and go home while everyone else is playing power games.

Bryan: What about Sterling Marlin and John Wick? Do they even talk to each other?

Dave: I doubt it. Sterling Marlin is probably just focused on the buses and logistics. John Wick is probably off doing whatever security does. They’re both pretty low-drama compared to everyone else, so they might actually get along fine out of sheer mutual disinterest in the bullshit.

Bryan: And Sheri L. Dew? How does she deal with all this degeneracy while being the CFO?

Dave: She probably just focuses on the numbers and tries to stay as far away from the creative and on-screen side as possible. I imagine she and Cowboy Watts have a very cold but functional working relationship. She handles the money, he handles the chaos, and they try not to talk about the details.

Bryan: This whole thing sounds like a powder keg. I don’t know how they haven’t had some kind of massive blow-up yet.

Dave: They probably have. We just haven’t heard about it yet.

Bryan Alvarez: Alright, real quick — who the hell is Sheri L. Dew? I keep seeing her name pop up as the CFO and I have no idea who that is.

Dave Meltzer: Sheri L. Dew is a pretty well-known figure in certain circles. She was a high-ranking executive in the Mormon church for a long time. Very prominent in their leadership and public relations side of things.

Bryan: Wait… she’s Mormon? Like, actual high-up Mormon church lady?

Dave: Yeah. She’s been pretty involved with them for decades.

Bryan: And now she’s the CFO of CELEB BITCHES WRESTLING LEAGUE? A company that does porta-potty matches and gloryhole segments? How the fuck does that happen?

Dave: I don’t know the full story. I’ve heard she’s mostly focused on the financial side and tries to stay away from the creative stuff.

Bryan: Is there some kind of Mormon connection here? Like, is this some kind of weird church thing? Because that would be insane.

Dave: (visibly uncomfortable, shifting in his seat) I… I don’t think so. I haven’t seen any real evidence of that. It’s probably just a coincidence. Or she needed the work. I wouldn’t read too much into it.

Bryan: You got weird for a second there. You okay?

Dave: I’m fine. I just… I’d rather not speculate too much about that kind of stuff. Some groups don’t like when people talk about them.

Bryan: What, like the Mormons are gonna come after you?

Dave: I’m not saying that. I’m just saying I’ve had bad experiences in the past with certain religious groups. Back when my daughter was younger, we had some issues with Jehovah’s Witnesses that got pretty intense. I’d just rather be safe than sorry when it comes to these things.

Bryan: Dave… Mormons and Jehovah’s Witnesses are not the same thing.

Dave: I know they’re not the same. But still. I’ve learned it’s better not to poke certain groups too hard, even if the chances are low. Some things just aren’t worth the risk.

Bryan: You’re actually scared of the Mormons?

Dave: I’m not scared. I’m just… cautious. There’s a difference. And in this case, I’d rather be cautious.

Bryan: This company really has you spooked, huh?

Dave: A little bit, yeah.

Bryan Alvarez: Come on, Dave. You brought it up. What actually happened with the Jehovah’s Witnesses? You can’t just say something like that and then shut down.

Dave Meltzer: (sighs, clearly uncomfortable) It was a long time ago. When my daughter was young, we had some Jehovah’s Witnesses in the neighborhood who got… aggressive. They started showing up at the house constantly. At first it was just knocking on the door, trying to talk to us. Then it got worse. They started following her to school. One of them tried to grab her arm one day when she was walking home. It scared the hell out of her. Scared the hell out of us.

Bryan: Jesus.

Dave: We had to get the police involved. It was a whole thing. And ever since then, I’ve just been very careful about religious groups that operate in that kind of aggressive, organized way. Even if it’s not the same group, I’d rather not poke the bear.

Bryan: That’s fucked up. I’m sorry that happened.

Dave: Yeah. It was bad. What made it even weirder was that Henry Winkler actually helped us out during that time. He knew someone who knew someone, and he helped us get some legal advice and support. And Dick Lane — you know, the old Olympics wrestling announcer — he reached out too. I think he heard about it through some wrestling connections. Both of them were really decent about it.

Bryan: Wait… Henry Winkler and Dick Lane helped you with a Jehovah’s Witnesses situation?

Dave: Yeah. It was a really dark time. I don’t talk about it much.

Bryan: Wow.

Dave: (suddenly shifting, looking uncomfortable) You know what, I shouldn’t have said any of that. That was… that was too much. I shouldn’t be talking about my daughter like this on air. That’s private. I don’t know why I even brought it up.

Bryan: You don’t have to go into detail if you don’t want to. I was just curious because you seemed shaken up about the Mormon thing.

Dave: Yeah, well… I overstepped. Let’s just leave it at that. I don’t want to drag my family into this. Forget I said anything.

Bryan: Alright. Consider it forgotten.

Dave: (quietly) Thanks.

Dave Meltzer: Look, I don’t want to make it sound all dark. There were some good things that came out of that time too. Like I said, Henry Winkler was really helpful. He actually reached out personally. And at one point… he even asked me for permission to date my daughter.

Bryan Alvarez: …What?

Dave: Yeah. He was very respectful about it. Called me up and everything. Said he wanted to take her out. I appreciated that he asked first.

Bryan: Hold on. Henry Winkler wanted to date your daughter?

Dave: That’s what he said. I mean, he’s a good guy. Very polite. But I had to turn him down.

Bryan: Why?

Dave: Because he wanted her to move to Florida with him. And I wasn’t about to let my daughter move across the country like that. We were settled in L.A. The family was there, her life was there. I wasn’t going to uproot everything just because The Fonz wanted to take her out.

Bryan: Dave… you turned down Henry Winkler because he lived in Florida?

Dave: It wasn’t just that. It was the whole situation. She was young, things were already stressful with everything that was going on. The last thing I needed was her moving to another state with a guy twice her age. Even if it was Henry Winkler.

Bryan: This is the most Dave Meltzer story I’ve ever heard in my life.

Dave: I’m just saying, family comes first. And at the time, keeping everyone in L.A. was the priority. I don’t regret it.

Bryan: So Henry Winkler asked to date your daughter, you said no because of Florida, and now years later you’re working for a company that makes porta-potty wrestling shows. Life is weird.

Dave: Tell me about it.

Bryan Alvarez: I mean, come on, Dave. You turned down Henry Winkler because of Florida, and now you’re working for CELEB BITCHES WRESTLING LEAGUE. At some point you gotta look at your life choices and—

Dave Meltzer: (cutting him off sharply) Bryan, stop. We’re not doing this.

Bryan: Doing what?

Dave: This whole “Dave’s life choices” thing. We’re not going down that road. I already know where this is going, and I’m not interested in having that conversation on air.

Bryan: I was just saying—

Dave: I know what you were saying. And I’m telling you right now, we’re not doing it. I’ve already had enough of people acting like they know what deals I have or don’t have. I’m not getting into it again.

Bryan: (smirking slightly) You mean like that time you accidentally said you get paid by AEW?

Dave: Exactly. That’s exactly what I’m talking about. People took that and ran with it, twisted it, made a whole thing out of it. I’m not doing that again. So let’s move on.

Bryan: Alright, alright. Message received.

Dave: Good. Because I’m not in the mood to have my words twisted into another meme today.

Bryan: Fair enough. We’ll drop it.

Dave Meltzer: You know, all this talk about Sterling Marlin and logistics and getting people in and out of buildings… it actually reminds me of an old story from back in the territory days. This was in Greensboro, I think it was ‘85 or ‘86. Dusty Rhodes was working the main event and something went wrong with the finish. The crowd didn’t like it at all. They started throwing shit in the ring, and before anyone knew what was happening, it turned into a full-blown riot.

Bryan Alvarez: Oh god, here we go.

Dave: Yeah, it got bad. People were climbing over the rail. The boys had to get out of there quick. Terry Labonte was there that night — I think he was doing some kind of crossover appearance or just hanging around because of the NASCAR connection — and he ended up driving the getaway car. They piled into this van and took off, but then somebody realized they forgot Dick Murdoch. So Terry had to turn around and go back.

Bryan: They left Dick Murdoch behind?

Dave: They had to. By the time they got back, the fans had already gotten to him pretty good. He was banged up. Meanwhile, Wahoo McDaniel was still hiding under the ring. And Steamboat — Ricky Steamboat — he was already gone. Smartest one there. He took off the second the riot started and headed straight for the airport.

Bryan: What about Dusty?

Dave: Dusty was with Terry in the van. But here’s the thing — Terry had to meet Bill Elliott because Bill was leaving in his helicopter and they were already running late. So they had to leave Dick Murdoch behind. They couldn’t wait. By the time they got to the airport, Steamboat had already beaten them there. But Dusty still managed to beat Steamboat to the next territory. Classic Dusty.

Bryan: That is the most ridiculous, most perfect wrestling story I’ve heard in a while.

Dave: That’s what it was like back then. You had to be ready to move. Sometimes the NASCAR guys were more reliable than the wrestlers when it came to getting everybody out safely. Different world.

Bryan: Well, on that note… I think that’s as good a place as any to end this. Dave, thanks as always.

Dave: Thanks, Bryan. We’ll talk again soon.

Bryan: This has been Wrestling Observer Live. We’ll see you next time.